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 Competitive AB Spots

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Pantherus
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PostSubject: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeFri Nov 07, 2008 6:08 am

Where do you think the really competitive AB spots are, and who should fill them?

I think #6 and the wings are the most competitive; all the others are pretty solidly filled.

For 6 I think it should be a good tussle between Kaino, Messam, Thomson and Read. If Messam can front at a test level then I think he should be the front runner - though admittedly I just cannot stand Read - he has that air of expectation, like he's somehow OWED an AB spot...

As for the Wings, my preference would be Rokocoko at 11 and Gear at 14. Sivivatu's far too inconsistent...
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeFri Nov 07, 2008 6:11 am

Yeh it was great to see Hosea get a nudge against the Wallabies even though he was quiet.

But his form this year has been to good to ignore. I would not be surprised at all if him and Joe become our first choice wingers by the end of this tour.

By the way welcome to the forum Pantherus.
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mintyjo400
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeFri Nov 07, 2008 7:39 am

i think on this years form gear has to get a spot
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Maccapacca
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeFri Nov 07, 2008 8:37 am

Second five eight
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Maccapacca
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeFri Nov 07, 2008 8:48 am

and prop
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Pantherus
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeFri Nov 07, 2008 10:57 am

SBW wrote:
By the way welcome to the forum Pantherus.

Cheers - good to be here Smile

scott.mckenzie wrote:
Second five eight and prop

A lot of people reckon Nonu's not the man there - I've heard others reckon he should move out to 13 and drop Smith.

Personally I think the Carter/Nonu/Smith trinity is a classic case of being "stronger than the sum of their parts" - meaning that as individuals, there are arguably stronger players, but together they form something far more powerful. Carter provides the primary kicking and guidance, Smith takes over from Aaron Mauger as the backline general, thus giving Carter more room to focus on himself. Nonu is the most devastating line breaking back in the world - nobody can really argue that point; with Carter and Smith guiding him, he becomes even more destructive; not to mention that his distribution abilities have skyrocketed. The boost in the ABs performance in HK after Donald was subbed for Nonu wasn't just because Carter was moved back to pivot, Nonu provided an extra punch; and it's also no coincidence that Carter is suddenly busting the line more and more this year with Nonu outside him - his presence means that the opposition 10, 12 AND 13 have to keep an eye on him, taking their focus away from their own opposites.


Prop I agree with you, who would you prefer? Woodcock should be a cert; Tialata? Afoa? Franks?
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Maccapacca
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeFri Nov 07, 2008 11:00 am

Pantherus wrote:
SBW wrote:
By the way welcome to the forum Pantherus.

Cheers - good to be here Smile

scott.mckenzie wrote:
Second five eight and prop

A lot of people reckon Nonu's not the man there - I've heard others reckon he should move out to 13 and drop Smith.

Personally I think the Carter/Nonu/Smith trinity is a classic case of being "stronger than the sum of their parts" - meaning that as individuals, there are arguably stronger players, but together they form something far more powerful. Carter provides the primary kicking and guidance, Smith takes over from Aaron Mauger as the backline general, thus giving Carter more room to focus on himself. Nonu is the most devastating line breaking back in the world - nobody can really argue that point; with Carter and Smith guiding him, he becomes even more destructive; not to mention that his distribution abilities have skyrocketed. The boost in the ABs performance in HK after Donald was subbed for Nonu wasn't just because Carter was moved back to pivot, Nonu provided an extra punch; and it's also no coincidence that Carter is suddenly busting the line more and more this year with Nonu outside him - his presence means that the opposition 10, 12 AND 13 have to keep an eye on him, taking their focus away from their own opposites.


Prop I agree with you, who would you prefer? Woodcock should be a cert; Tialata? Afoa? Franks?

Woodcock and Afoa
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Sports_Legend
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeFri Nov 07, 2008 11:03 am

I think the jamie macantosh is a good player atleast the boys from the deep south have another all black. I dont rate tialata or afoa. What are some commentaors on about they actually think that scottland can beat the Ab's I really doubt it they wont came anywhere near. I believe it will be atleast 50, and imagine what the Ab's will do to the weaker teams they are going to verse. Why are they saying that Dainel Carter has to miss one game or something like this?

Is this Graham Henery again going with his resting policy. Robbie Deans should of got the coaching job although he isnt do that good over in auzzie i am sure he would coach a lot better in his home country.

Corey Jane has been given a chance this week and i reckon he will do a great job at the back, originally from canterbury.
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Pantherus
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2008 2:54 am

Jason wrote:
I think the jamie macantosh is a good player atleast the boys from the deep south have another all black. I dont rate tialata or afoa. What are some commentaors on about they actually think that scottland can beat the Ab's I really doubt it they wont came anywhere near. I believe it will be atleast 50, and imagine what the Ab's will do to the weaker teams they are going to verse. Why are they saying that Dainel Carter has to miss one game or something like this?

Is this Graham Henery again going with his resting policy. Robbie Deans should of got the coaching job although he isnt do that good over in auzzie i am sure he would coach a lot better in his home country.

Corey Jane has been given a chance this week and i reckon he will do a great job at the back, originally from canterbury.

Mackintosh is good - but he's a specialist loosehead so he's always gonna be fighting with Woodcock. Afoa is solid around the field but I still have doubts about his scrummaging abilities. Tialata can be absolutely fantastic, but he seems to forget that a lot...

Scotland have certainly got the heart, but I don't think they have the firepower; even against a second string AB side.

Carter has to miss at least one game because even he and McCaw cannot maintain their form through 5 test matches back to back - and they need to be on their game for the Wales and England matches which should prove the biggest challenges.

There are differences to managing the workloads of his players and the rotation of old - although the mistake of the old policy was not rotation itself (it brought a lot of good players out of the woodwork who otherwise wouldn't have had much game time) but rather continuing said rotation into the WC year and even during the WC itself.

Deans should NOT have been given the ABs job, and their victories this year already should have proven that Henry is still a more than capable coach - Deans on the other hand has done very little to change the Wallabies except to adjust their attacking structure somewhat. I still maintain (though very few agree with me) that Deans would have ruined the ABs like he did with Mitchell in their time - there would've been a whole pile of undeserving canterbury players getting AB spots ahead of more capable other players.

Finally - Cory Jane originally from Canterbury? Don't make me laugh. He's born and bred Upper Hutt mate.
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NBrown#16
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2008 4:48 am

tialata doesn't seem that bad to me but probably not what we are looking for to win the world cup in 2011
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Sports_Legend
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2008 5:54 am

Get Graham Henry out of there, he doesn't look any further than auckland. Half of the team is from there and auckland got 2nd to last in anz cup and 9th or so in super-14. Jerome kiano what form has he show and toevave he has had like a dozen of opportunities and hasn't delivered. Read is a way better player than kiano, ellis is better than weepu, thompson is better than kiano..... etc.......

Any thoughts.......
Interested to know your thoughts.......
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Sports_Legend
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2008 5:57 am

Pantherus wrote:
Jason wrote:
I think the jamie macantosh is a good player atleast the boys from the deep south have another all black. I dont rate tialata or afoa. What are some commentaors on about they actually think that scottland can beat the Ab's I really doubt it they wont came anywhere near. I believe it will be atleast 50, and imagine what the Ab's will do to the weaker teams they are going to verse. Why are they saying that Dainel Carter has to miss one game or something like this?

Is this Graham Henery again going with his resting policy. Robbie Deans should of got the coaching job although he isnt do that good over in auzzie i am sure he would coach a lot better in his home country.

Corey Jane has been given a chance this week and i reckon he will do a great job at the back, originally from canterbury.

Mackintosh is good - but he's a specialist loosehead so he's always gonna be fighting with Woodcock. Afoa is solid around the field but I still have doubts about his scrummaging abilities. Tialata can be absolutely fantastic, but he seems to forget that a lot...

Scotland have certainly got the heart, but I don't think they have the firepower; even against a second string AB side.

Carter has to miss at least one game because even he and McCaw cannot maintain their form through 5 test matches back to back - and they need to be on their game for the Wales and England matches which should prove the biggest challenges.

There are differences to managing the workloads of his players and the rotation of old - although the mistake of the old policy was not rotation itself (it brought a lot of good players out of the woodwork who otherwise wouldn't have had much game time) but rather continuing said rotation into the WC year and even during the WC itself.

Deans should NOT have been given the ABs job, and their victories this year already should have proven that Henry is still a more than capable coach - Deans on the other hand has done very little to change the Wallabies except to adjust their attacking structure somewhat. I still maintain (though very few agree with me) that Deans would have ruined the ABs like he did with Mitchell in their time - there would've been a whole pile of undeserving canterbury players getting AB spots ahead of more capable other players.

Finally - Cory Jane originally from Canterbury? Don't make me laugh. He's born and bred Upper Hutt mate.

Graham henry has done nothing, sorry corey jane played 7's for canterbury. McCaw cant keep form lol it is the most ridiculous thing i have heard. Graham Henry is just a DH
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KromyD
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2008 6:21 am

On the wing id like to see Kahui & Gear start with Rokocoko on the bench and in the forwards, push So'oialo to 6 and put Messam at 8. One more change, take Ellis out of the squad and put in Cowan, Ellis just isnt on the money for me.
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Sports_Legend
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2008 6:26 am

KromyD wrote:
On the wing id like to see Kahui & Gear start with Rokocoko on the bench and in the forwards, push So'oialo to 6 and put Messam at 8. One more change, take Ellis out of the squad and put in Cowan, Ellis just isnt on the money for me.

Agree with everything except dont have rokocoko in the team and put read in for so'oialo and put cowan at 9 and ellis on bench
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Pantherus
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PostSubject: Re: Competitive AB Spots   Competitive AB Spots Icon_minitimeSun Nov 09, 2008 11:33 pm

Jason wrote:

Agree with everything except dont have rokocoko in the team and put read in for so'oialo and put cowan at 9 and ellis on bench

I dunno - I was impressed with Roko's workrate against Scotland and he showed he's pushing to get back there.

I'm picking Rokocoko and Gear as our top wings by the end of the tour. Kahui is good, but he's not a wing. The coaches made it clear that they want him as a midfielder and he certainly pushed his case for it in that game - Kahui vs Smith will be a good competition point.

No way is Ellis playable ahead of Weepu.
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